under age access

[Malatesta]

I discovered this piece of 'malware' on my son's computer - and tried the usual things to try and get rid of it - i then contacted MBS informing them that the access was by a minor and as such the bill would not be piad.

they then sent this long email with a declaration to be signed by a solicitor to verify my son was under 18. they made a number of threats about legally binding contracts etc. and i replied thus:

I must take exception with some of the points made in your response to my refusal to pay for this bill -
1 - the computer is in my son's bedroom - it is not my computer.
2 - it is not even clear that my son accessed this site - it could have been one of his friends using his computer.
3 i will be contacting the Citizens Advice about your request that i pay a solicitor to sign the declaration -
4 i will be contacting the relevant regulatory body in order to confirm that your approach is legal in providing unrestricted access to minors of adult content based purely on their say so
5 given that my son is under 18 then it is surely illegal for you to allow them access to adult content or any other site that is illegal for a minor to access
6 there can be no legally binding contract between yourself and a minor especially in regard to adult content

we then got a email asking us to contacts them by phone - this we did - but it was like talking to a brick wall - why should i have to go and pay a solicitor for signed declaration of our son's age! I told them that the most i would do was send a photocopy of his passport by secure mail - and told them i would be going to Citizen;s Advice, as i thought that my point 6 above was valid - and this seems to be the advice of the legal dude quoted in the guardian story about MBS

anyway - i have now removed the offending popup bill using advice on here and it seems to have worked

[ForumFriend]

Malatesta:
Re your points:

"3 i will be contacting the Citizens Advice about your request that i pay a solicitor to sign the declaration -
4 i will be contacting the relevant regulatory body in order to confirm that your approach is legal in providing unrestricted access to minors of adult content based purely on their say so"

My question to you is:  Have you done this? 

I think it might be helpful to others to know the answers to these points, and if you can share anything further on this, please do.

In your position, you should consider reporting the matter to Trading Standards, and also perhaps raising the issue with your MP.

[fran]

My son also had this horrible pop up appear, showing that he had registered on a sex site on the night of his 10th birthday, when he had a lot of his mates around for a sleepover.

I phoned the number, putting 141 in front, and told them that we didn't even know who had accessed the site or if it had even been accessed at all, and the guy took great delight in giving me the date it had been accessed - the day, hour, minute and second (I think he's quite excited by his company's technology, bless!).

I did try to make the point that no company should be charging a ten year old boy £39.99, through his pc, whom they do not have any details on, no name, address, login details etc, for access to a porn site which is operating completely unethically, but basically I was actually 'told off' over the phone for being such an irresponsible parent; they weren't actually interested at all in the harm and upset in peoples homes that their business is causing.

Anyway, they have emailed me a form as per Malatesta's post, and I am going to take it to my solicitor to see what she would charge to witness a signature.

[Andy M]

Someone on another forum said that you should be able to get a signature witness from anyone who can witness for a passport - so it doesn't have to be a solicitor, but could be a doctor, or a teacher, for example. There might be different rules for this form, but it might be worth checking. I'll see if I can find what they said.

It's distressing now, Fran, but I'm looking forward to the time when these people are "told off" for their underhand tactics, and being an irresponsible company.

Some call centre guy (and please note, I'm not putting down people who work in call centres) from a scummy "business" like MBS has absolutely no right to lecture you on being a responsible parent.

[ForumFriend]

Fran:

You've probably already read this elsewhere on this site, but I'll repeat this anyway.

Please report this to Trading Standards, the police, and your MP.  It is not a reasonable defence for this company to make that it is your responsibility to stop your son/his friends from accessing their site. 

I can fully understand, for your own peace of mind, that you want to get this resolved - but please also remember that it is the complaints of vicitims like yourself that help the authorities to build up a picture of what is happening and the distress it is causing.

When you complain to Trading Standards, may I suggest you do it both to West Yorkshire Trading Standards, who oversee businesses in that area (where MBS are 'based') and also to Trading Standards in the area where you live.  This is perfectly acceptable, and your local Trading Standards are likely to be more willing to discuss the issue directly with you.

It is worth pointing out to them that access to the websites that they serve do not require the user to provide any personal details, nor credit card or other payment details.  This makes under age use extremely likely.

Your local MP should be prepared to follow up the matter on your behalf.  If you find that s/he is not very responsive,  please will you let this forum know.

The police should be informed because of the age of the person who accessed the website.  Again, if you find your local police don't seem particularly interested, it could be worth asking them to whom you could address your concerns.

You should not be put to any expense to have to 'prove' the age of your child.  His teacher, or your GP, is perfectly competent to confirm that he is underage. 

It is my opinion that MBS are asking parents to do this as a way of putting pressure upon them to 'pay up' since some people might think it too much trouble, and possibly too expensive, to go to a solicitor.  In fact, most solicitors do not charge a great deal for this service, but that is beside the point.

[fran]

Thank you Andy & ForumFriend for your replies and support.  I will be posting out letters to Trading Standards, MP and Police on Monday and will let you know the responses from each.  I will also look more into getting the paperwork signed off as I still want closure on this thing.

[Malatesta]

Thanks to all posters for their thoughts and commiserations to Fran who has had a similar experience as myself.

i will be taking you advice and getting on to my local Trading Standards (and also West Yorkshire as they seem to be leading on this)

i am concerned that this is not over, as in our haste to contact the company to try and resolve this - i did not 141 my phone call -

i will post further once i have contacted the relevant authorities and received a response from them